*Correct me if I'm wrong.


You've been corrected.

So you have to daily drive your car to work everyday in order to have a street car? So if I bought a GTR like USDM said below and I only liked to take it out on the weekend that doesn't make it a street car anymore?

It's funny that a GTR was mentioned as well, two weeks ago I watched a guy who drove his GTR to the track and didn't even make a full pass because it broke on the track. Let's just say his car got towed home that night.

I ran a 10.8 @ 100 on the gate spring which has a 6lb spring, looking at the logs I was running 12psi 1 thru 3rd and didn't even shift into 4th and slowed down before I was at the end of the track.

I also don't change my tunes for summer or winter and my car will easily and safely make 600 plus whp on pump e85 which is sold at multiple gas stations.

So technically I can switch from E98 to E85 and run 10's all day, I can put my slicks in my trunk drive to the track and drive home when I am done. Like I said before, I have all my interior, carpets, seats, my windows go up and down electrically, the only thing I don't have is AC but if you tell me because I don't have AC it's not a street car you guys are crazy.

Now is my car as comfortable or as cool as a GTR? No but that doesn't mean my car can't be daily driven, again full interior, full panels, registered and insured. My skinnies and slicks aren't welded on I do put streets rims and tires back on the car when It's not at the track LOL.

Mr. AZ_CIVIC, there is more to a daily than just the comfort of the interior.

You should prove your boast in the other thread and come to WHP this January for a NASA event.

Actually, I have an easier way of conveying our thoughts.

Tell us why you don't daily your race car?

Nevermind lols
His race car is probably more reliable and road safe than what a lot of people daily drive on this site. He just has a more comfortable car to daily drive. Driving his civic will also put unecessary wear on $ parts.

Like what? This is what I keep asking, are you saying that I have to drive the car everyday, take it to every store and now I have to drive my car at WHP for it to be a street car?

First of all I technically don't have to daily anything. For the people who actually know me they would know I am a Business Analyst who works from home, that's 1. Second if and when I actually feel like going into the office like I did today, I have to drop my son off at school and then head 35 miles to the office.

My wife uses her TL to go to work which leaves me my truck or an automatic 2012 Honda Civic or my "race car" so what would someone with some logic do?
Well I guess I will choose the automatic Civic that gets 35 MPG and is easier to drive when stopping and going at 10 to 15 mph in the hour and 10 minute one way drive through traffic right?

Even if I had a stock GTR I would choose to drive the Civic in slow non stop traffic. Who am I going to impress by driving my GTR 10 mph through traffic? Why would I risk some a hole hitting into me while driving to work when I can take a Civic?

Why don't I take it to every store to go shopping? Mainly because I don't want it to be screwed with or stolen. If I am going for a cruise, taking the car to the Pavillions where I can watch it or have a nice little weekend drive to open it up on the road is what I like to do with the car. Is there something wrong with having a car that you use just for fun instead of DD. If you choose to buy a Porsche, Toyota and Miata and modify all of them that is your choice. If you find joy in DD a modified car through traffic good for you.

Don't worry Crono I was a immature kid like you once who also had dumb ideas of what cars "where" supposed to be. Hell I used to think if you didn't run NA and went turbo or bottle it was cheating, I was all about the throttle and no bottle life. I grew up long ago and realized that just driving a stock auto TSX and now truck or Civic is way nicer if when driving to work or with the family and when I want some street fun or track fun I have a car specifically for that.

Hope this helps answer your questions Crono.:biggrin:

True, I have a NHRA certified 10 point chromoly cage that is padded as well, 5 point harness, window net and nice Kirkey seat so if I mess up I have some nice protection.

Also yes I have a more comfy DD for the stresses of driving through heavy traffic.

Absolutely.

You RACE car isn't a street car because it is uncomfortable for more than 10 minutes, because you can't just pop into any gas station and fill'er up. Because it isn't a car your wife could/would/should drive to the groceries in a pinch.

Kirkey seats, 10 point cages, 5 point harnesses, race/e-85 gas requirements, etc - are not street car applicable. It doesn't matter that you can switch all that out - what matters is you would have to. And yes, your Kirkey is not comfortable for more than 10-15 mintues - before you even say it.

It is cool you have it street registered and insured. I know guys with full caged/ and tube chassis cars that have a plate and insurance. That doesn't make them any more of a street car than your car.

I am not knocking your car at all (like I have said 1000000000 times, yet you still get defensive..) but face the fact - You car is was built to run quarters - not to cruise about in. Just because it has plates and insurance doesn't make it a "street car."


You act like all this is an insult and it really isn't. IMO there is a line between race car - and street car. Your car crosses it and dwell in the race car category. This is a debate that has existed every since people were front or back halving cars and calling them "street" cars.

Always on the defensive, and always looking to throw in those low jabs at me. I'm not different than you because I am young or immature or have dumb ideas. I am different from you because I am different.

But aside from what Paul was saying, I got exactly what I wanted from you. You nailed it on the dot of why your civic isn't really a street car.

It all changes on what one's definition of street car is... and at that point, arguing relative terms is redundant. For example, Spec C will probably not daily his NSX. To Spec, it is not a daily driver. That's why he has an ISF. Ravi, on the other hand, dailies his NSX without hesitation. Some people can daily a GTR. Some keep it as a weekend car. Your race car isn't a street car because it is not a car you can comfortably daily. Driving in traffic with all that horsepower under the engine and all that attention isn't something you want. The cage, the harnesses, everything Paul mentioned. You may have a different definition of what a 'street' car is, but I think as a rule of thumb, your car isn't a street car any more than a stripped out caged Miata is a street car.

We differ in philosophies with this line, which you also nailed on the head.


I do. I love driving all of my cars, even the gay slow Miata. And I think a lot of that has to do with our difference in lifestyle. I go to a lot of places, because I am single and young and have a busy schedule. You work at home, are a dad, and drive only occasionally. You don't enjoy driving (even if it's slow ass traffic) the same way I enjoy driving. That is also reflective on the type of racing we like. You find going from 0-150 mph awesome, while I find braking from 120 to 60 more awesome. I would absolutely kill myself if I had to drive a boring automatic every day, even if it is in traffic. That's something you don't mind.

So when you say
You may have very well been a dumb and immature kid who messes up "where we're and were". Don't associate your idiocy in youth with me.

So Paul here is where I get a bit confused, have you drove my car and I don't remember letting you drive it, you too Crono?

So I will demonstrate through some pictures to try and clarify the confusion.

So here is what I would consider a drag or race car. So let's start with interior

Drag Car, this I am guessing would be a bit uncomfortable to drive all over..



Now here is a picture of my interior that has been in the car forever. Look at this picture and tell me how this interior would be so uncomfortable that I couldn't last 10 minutes. Hell this interior is cleaner and more comfy looking than Cronos who claims to daily it everyday. Oh by the way I DD'd the car for years with this same interior minus the cage. I think the difference between the above and mine are way different.










Now let's take a look at what I consider a drag chassis that I don't think would be that streetable





Now here are some pictures of my chassis and car






Now you also say my car can't be a street car because the 10 point cage, look at the above pictures does it look like my interior could no be sat in and drove around? You say a 5 point harness makes it not a street car. So let's take a look at my big bad harness, why would this make my car not a street car?




Now you say my car is not a street car because I can't drive into a gas station and fill up, this was an old dyno sheet from a pump e85 tune I had on my car before I switched to Ignite and now am on e98. I can load an e85 tune on my ecu and run it for ever if I wanted.



So how you can look at my car and think it is a full race dragster that can't be driven around is just crazy.

I never said it was a "full race dragster" I just said it was a "purpose built drag car."

I don't know how you don't get this.

Kirkey seat = Not a streetable seat. I don't care what you say. It limits your visibility, it isn't comfortable. It isn't safe for street use because of the limited visibility - period. You wouldn't take that car, with that seat on a 2 hour drive. Couple that with 5 point harnesses and it compounds the issue. I have driven cars with those seats, they suck for any extended time. Anyone who says otherwise is full of it. I could be wrong, but I don't even think the way you have the harnesses ran with your "stock" seat is acceptable safety wise....

Fuel - If you are limited to what uncommon stations you can go to (race or E-85) and you have to upload a different map just to run E-85. Not a street car. If you have to research what stations you can go to when in a unfamiliar part of town - it isn't a "street car..."

Wheels tires - You have to change all four.

Back seats - uninhabitable safely.

Passenger floorboard - "please don't step on my ecu...."

Suspension - you have a pretty trick looking setup on that. But that is not "street car" suspension. Spherical bearings are not exactly comfortable in the NVH side of things... Strange coilovers? While they make nice stuff - those are predominantly drag car parts. Sure you can run them on the street - but that isn't their main purpose. I have installed quite a bit of Strange parts.


What exhaust is it tuned for? Oh yeah , not a street legal one....

Cooling system... can your car honestly idle for extended periods of time in the summer? Probably not.

Since I am not familiar with twin disks and dog cut gears in a FWD I will give that the benefit of doubt...

You car was purpose built for a specific racing class. It wasn't built to be a fast street car. It isn't something you would take on say - the Sedona cruise. You trailer it because it could very possibly break because of it being a race car.

If only one or two of these compromises existed - yeah, ok - it is a street car. But all of it together, not so much.

I have owned a high 9/low 10 second car. I have driven many, many others. Very few, if any were what I could call a "street car."

Taking it out a few times a year for a short trip to show it off doesn't make it a street car. I can legally drive a tractor, lawnmower, NEV golf cart, etc on the street - but this does not make them a "street car."

I don't know why you can't just accept the fact you have a badass street-registered drag car?

You know what?
For the sake of brevity, you win. I don't think it matters how many examples I (we) provide. I don't even think compromise (most of my last post) will have you even try to see from our point of view. It's like arguing global warming with a Republican. You care about proving your point more than self enlightenment; about what you could possibly learn from other people other than yourself. Stroking that e-pene is #1. That must explain why you've done nothing but drive in a straight line with the same car for 10 years.

And since you are always on the defensive and want to prove your point tooth and nail, I'm just going to relent and let you have this argument. Nice street car you have.

None of us are insulting your car. None of us are even remotely insulting you, unlike the way you throw low jabs at me at any given opportunity. But since you took it there again, and I'm not really having a nice day, I think I've earned the right to step up and defend myself for once.

Neither of us have anything to prove. You can insult my 86 all you like, because you're right. The interior of my 86 is pretty shabby. Some of the trim is cracked, and the cloth could use some reupholstering. It has signs that it is a 30 year old car which has been driven. But I do drive it everyday (at least, when it's not at Ravi's... and I've been driving my Miata more frequently recently). But in the end, you don't care about the differences of how my car differs from yours in both end-goal and spirit. You don't care that my 86 isn't competing with yours in speed or luxury. All you see is a stock S2000 motor in an old ratty car. It's slower and not as nice, but because its build thread starts drawing attention, you immediately start stroking that e-pene. Wanna know something? In a few months, I'm going to have a car that is both nicer and faster than your Civic. And it didn't take me 10 years to get there.

And gosh, I wonder what will happen when I'm your age? Will you still be driving that 10 second Civic?

It is the same story with most "drag guys" that have really fast street registered drag cars.

They will all argue till they are blue in the face that their PITA to drive on the street car is a "street" car when it isn't. Like it is some sort of badge of honor they must lay claim to. It is dumb. I don't see what the point is. I never had any issues admitting one of my cars was a "race car."



There comes a point when you have built a car to be so singular in purpose that it ceases being multi-role. It is a fact, the nature of the beast. Unavoidable.



.

Faster as in turns? Or you plan to be running 9s in the 1/4 like Az_civic?
I'm actually curious....

Both.

EDIT: I take that back. The chances of a 10 second car being fun to drive day to day is slim.

Oh well, guess I'll just be content with being nicer.

What's up with this 10 year shit son, you think because I have had the same Civic for 7 years it has taken me that long to do what it's doing? Take a look at my build thread dipshit, my NEW build or should I say another build started in 2013 and I was at IFO with this setup in January of 2014.

Second I don't spend each check on my car, my car is like a third priority to me. You're like a virgin who just got laid with your car shit. I just dropped 60k cash down payment on my SECOND home last April and another 20k this summer on my back yard. Like I said cars are not some huge deal for me like you man. This is just a hobby that I screw around with, if something happens to my car I don't care if it sits six months until I get around to fixing it.

:thumbsup:

There we go. Now I'm getting to you. That's the kind of posting that's AZHT worthy.

You post up timeslips and dynosheets because that's the only kind of gratitude you get around here. It surely doesn't come from conversation, as far as I can tell. Stroking that E-Pene all day erry'day because you've done the same shit for 15 years and can finally break 9 seconds. Or was that 10? If I had any interest in drag cars, I could sell all my stocks and buy a drag car for sale that goes faster without ever wasting an hour building it. Goes to show you how dumb your sport is.

Speaking of wages, you feel the need to flaunt salaries now? About how your life is so good, Mr. Stay at Home Dad? How's this. My family came here as a family of 8, with me being the youngest. They had no means, didn't speak English, and worked their asses off to get me through college. I had a harder life, a harder upbringing, and I am doing damn well with the cards that I've been given. I've got my mom as a dependent too, so that's a nice portion of my paycheck. You think I spend each check on my car? The only money that goes into my car is the money I earn from my investments. I get more money watching a stock ticker on my phone than I did during every job I had in college.

I post up videos of me catching up on brand new M3s and SVT Cobras in a 30 year old Corolla. That and I get to enjoy my car every day. I could flaunt that too, but I'm quite happy with my e-pene size, and I'm Asian. I wonder how bad you must have it to feel the need to defend your car and how cool it is at every single turn (or lack thereof, since you can only drive in straight lines).

I don't care when you started building your little Civic, dipshit. It's all you can talk about anyways whenever a conversation comes up. You're like an overly attached girlfriend who can't get over the fact that their boyfriend sometimes might not be the shit. I've only been in the workforce for two years, and I've worked my ass off to get to where I am. My car is not a huge ego-killer for me like you man. It's just a hobby that I screw around with.

In a way, I feel sad for you. You who are content driving an automatic vehicle for your day to day for the sake of your kids. You who doesn't know the joy of going sideways or taking a fun corner and feeling the road. You who doesn't understand why your comment about traction control was hilarious. I've experienced your world. I've been on a drag strip. It's boring as fuck. It's no fun because if I bring my car to a straight line fight between you and me, we already know who's going to win. That isn't the case in road racing.

You want me to post up videos of me kicking your ass? Come to WHP this upcoming January. I'll even run in my 86. There's a nice long straightaway for you to get plenty of distance. If I can close the gap before we come back to the straightaway, you lose.

Brand new SVT Cobra?

Sorry, but that is B.S. The side bolsters, limited visibility when using a 5-point, etc - all suck. I don't care what you say just to try to not admit you have a purpose built drag car that has plates on it. The padding and adjustable rails does not address why it isn't comfy in a normal use scenario - I have owned 3 cars with Kirkey seats. Properly installed. I even have a 30 inch waist. They sucked in a real street car.

Good for you. It has always been my understanding that using OEM seats with harnesses is a bit of a no-no unless they are specifically made to support them. But I could be wrong or my info could be outdated. I still wouldn't do it though. That and nothing says race car like 8.50 certified roll cage lol.

Nothing. For a race car. For the street they suck because they transmit quite a bit more vibration, kickback, etc. Stop trying to by coy and twist my comments around. Nowhere have I said any of this is bad parts. Infact I compliment you on everything you have done. But purpose built race car parts don't work well on normal use street cars. There is a reason OEMs and most aftermarket companies use rubber or poly. They are softer, deflect, and require less maintenance - all things you want in a s t r e e t c a r.

I am more than aware that a turbo can muffle exhaust. But considering you are not tuned on a catalytic convertor and don't run one - or a full exhaust for that matter - technically that isn't legal on a street car that was originally equipped with one. Nice try though.

Love that you think that means anything. I don't care what your race class requires. It doesn't require that you actually drive the car on the street now does it? Or that you operate it in ways that a normal street car would be correct? It doesn't stipulate that the car has to be fun to drive on the street for an extended time. You built a car to race in a specific class and not be driven on the street - this = race car.


I never said they couldn't be driven on the street - I said they were not much fun on the street. Since apparently you can't be an adult with me and you feel the need to resort to insult - maybe you should learn to read as you seem to dance around and skip around my points. Trust me, I can hold my own with a wrench. I have the magazine features, book features, auction records, trophies, awards, etc to prove it.

Past tense. Past PS. Past AC. Past suspension work. You don't DD it now. You don't come anywhere close to using it on the street regularly. This is a great validation of my point.

None of this still changes the fact that you have a street registered purpose built drag car. It spends most of it's life being prepped, built, trailered, tuned, and ran down the quarter. Not on the street, not being used as a normal car. Why you resort to petty insult because you don't like the debate - that is your own issue but you won't change my opinion on what your car is.


There comes a point when you have built a car to be so singular in purpose that it ceases being multi-role. It is a fact, the nature of the beast. Unavoidable.

You car has become more race car - than street car. So much so - that is predominately race car. Spherical suspension bearings. Drag optimized shocks/springs. 10 point cert'd cage. Kirkey seat. Harnesses. "Special" fuel. None of these make it a better street car. They in fact make it a worse street car - but a better as a drag car. Therefore it is a purpose built drag car. Pretty logical and easy to understand.

Street car is a term based on the majority use of the car, not that it has a plate on it.


The funniest part is how many times I have complimented you on your car. However, you can't separate friendly debate from taking things as an insult and getting defensive. Don't lump me in with your Crono battle. I have been cordial this entire fun little argument.

The best part of all this B.S.? It all started because I said your perception of what fast and slow is - differs from most others because you have a really fast car.

edit:


Proceed

Shut up Joe, AZHT finally has something to read.

I agree w Crono.

Round eye and slant eye ruined this thread.:newwhip:

Sorry about the thread bro, just not going to let Paul try and talk his game like he is master of all cars.
The guy has never seen my car in person, never drove my car but claims to know how it rides, what it can do, how it steers, how comfortable the car is.
As for Crono he is LOL, get a couple AZHT cool guys like Paul to tell him sucking dick is cool and the dude is on board.

You can delete all my posts to clean it up in here.

No. I'm on track to make this AZHT Greatest Threads Thunderdome material. Don't clean up shit.

You take pot shots at me when you can. Most of the days I don't pay any mind, but yesterday I was feeling adventurous and bored at work. Now that I start talking back, you avoid all of the text in my posts and resort to childish insults. My posts, like Paul, have never been anything but quaint with you. Now I start calling you out, and the best you can come back with is "Crono sucks dick"?

Hey asshole, I called you and your car out. I'm sure most of AZHT wants to see it too, and frankly, I'm curious of what you and your car can do on the same track with me and my car. You gonna man up or be a pussy?

Nope. You didn't keep me from anything. All my points are still valid. I am not master of anything, but I have had extensive experience with a wide range of cars. Considering what I have done, and the fact I don't really mention/post/brag about it on here - your comment is really grasping. I could easily make one post a day about something I was involved with that was significant automotively - for years. In terms of ego and self-promotion, you have me beat hands down - and I am cool with that.


Nope. I never claimed to have seen your car, nor drive it. It isn't rocket science to know what works well on the street, and what works well on the track.

Nope. I didn't tell Crono anything about this thread. What he does, he does on his own accord. Have we had a laugh at your expense at all this? Probably.


Nope. All this can stay. I like it. Illustrates some things perfectly.


It is cool though, insult me all you want. Doesn't help your side of the debate.

Doesn't change the fact your car spends more time being prepped, built, trailered, and tuned for the strip - instead of the street - by a large margin. Also, as I have said 10000x times. I have not insulted you, or your car. In fact - nothing but compliments from me.

Not my problem you can't handle a friendly debate. I think our debate has ran it's course, we both disagree. At least one of us (me) handled it like an adult despite your repeated insults past and present.

As for your Crono thing - My name is Paul, and that is between Yall. I have nothing to do with that. You two can carry on - I am sure it will be entertaining.

You called me out where, to road race? Didn't you and Paul just prove my car only goes in a straight line, I mean you just spent post after post talking about how my car is a purpose built drag car for drag racing only and now all of a sudden it is supposed to be a road race car as well?

Now, where in any of my posts do I talk about my car being a road racing warrior, when have I ever said road racing sucks? When have I ever mentioned that my car makes a good road racing car or that I can beat a ton of road racers? Never

All I hear from you is how Drag Racing is easy, How Drag Racing is stupid, how Drag Racers just press the gas and go straight. So let me see you bring your car out to Wild Horse Pass, press the gas and beat my car, let me see you break into a 1.5 sixty foot. Didn't you just say your car is going to look better, run 9's and road race?

Oh my god its like high school all over again!